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December 2001

Steven Tallents who has the very interesting Football 57 website, has updated me with more of his recent contacts. As Steve says himself, they are not all 70s players, but it makes interesting reading so I've included them all here...

1 Acquired 3 signed pictures of Luigi Riva, Giacinto Facchetti and Pelé, all of whom played in the 1970 World Cup Final. What a great game that was, I remember it like it was yesterday.

2, Les Bradd (Notts County): His most memorable moment was scoring a hat-trick for Stockport whilst playing against Barnsley. Stockport were 4-1 down with less than 10 minutes left and fought back to earn a 4-4 draw. That was his only hat-trick in a career where he scored over 200 goals.

3, Bill Marshall (Burnley, Oldham, Hartlepool 1959-65): he writes" I have had many memorable moments in my career, my first one was coming from Northern Ireland and signing for Burnley, meeting and being helped by the likes of G Bray, Billy Morris and Jimmy McIllroy. My most memorable moment has to be playing for Northern Ireland B team at Windsor Park Belfast against Romania, when my Dad and family where in the crowd".

4, Geoff Ball (Notts County): he writes" I have two memorable moments in my career which I find hard to separate, making my debut for Nottingham Forest at Arsenal when I was 18. We beat them 3-0. Second, making my debut for Notts County at Meadow Lane. I hit the cross bar from 30 yards with Les Bradd converting the rebound. We won 3-2".

5 Ronald de Boer (Rangers & Holland): he writes" Winning the Champions League was my greatest memory".

6, Willie Irvine (Preston North End & N.Ireland): he writes" Everyone has got an ambition, my own was to be in a Northern Ireland side to win at Wembley. This I achieved and the memory of the celebrations never leave me".

7. Brian Bates (Notts County, Mansfield Town 1963-69): he writes" I have had many memorable moments as a player but perhaps my favourite is the story of my 20 hr day at the start of the 1965/66 Season. I got up at 05:15 am to go down to the Nottingham Wholesale Market where I worked for 4 hours before reporting to Meadow Lane for training. When I got there I was told by the manager, Tim Coleman, that I was playing for the first team that evening at Stockport County. I scored two goals that evening as we won 3-1 and I finally got into bed at 01:15 the next morning. Some Day. That was the start of an excellent season for me which resulted in me being voted Player of the Year for the 1965/66 Season".

8 Tommy Cummings (Burnley, Mansfield Town 1948-1963): he writes" My most memorable moment must be when we won the last game of the 1959/60 Season to win the Football League".

9, Dennis Oakes (Notts County): he writes" Apart from the thrill of playing professional football and cricket, I played with some very talented players at Notts County. It was a great pleasure to play with players like Dave Needham. Les Bradd, Dave Watson and Don Masson. Dave and Don going on to pay for their countries".

10, Jon Nixon (Notts County): he writes" Perhaps the most memorable moment of my career as a player would be whilst with Peterborough. When during a 3rd Round FA Cup replay against Nottingham Forest, I returned to the pitch after receiving six stitches in a leg wound to score the only goal in our victory which secured a 4th Round tie at Old Trafford against Manchester Utd".

11, Barry Stobart (Wolves, Man City, Aston Villa, Shrewsbury 1959-1968): he writes" My most memorable moment are two fold, a debut at an Utd which we won  and I scored in front of 60,000 fans. The 1959/60 Cup final against Blackburn which we won in front of 100,000 fans".

12, Richie Barker (Notts County): he writes" Scoring the only goal in my debut game against Huddersfield at the Baseball ground for Derby is still a memorable moment".

13, Don Masson (Notts County): he writes" The match I remember most was the World Cup game at Anfield which Scotland won 2-0 and I was fortunate enough to score from the penalty spot".

14, Leslie Smith (Wolves and Aston Villa 1947-58): he writes" Playing for the Wolves in the late 40's and 50's, beating Honved and Spartak Moscow, winning the 1st Division Championship and winning the FA Cup at Wembley, transferred to Aston Villa in 1956 and then beating Man Utd 2-1 at Wembley in 1957. Winning the FA Cup for the 6th Time".

15, Bob Forrest (Leeds Utd, Notts County 1952-1961): he writes" It's a long time since I signed any autographs, I once scored a hat-trick for Leeds against Bristol Rovers in the 2nd Division match but I think the most memorable match would be when I played against Man Utd at Leeds 3 weeks before the Munich Air crash and drew 1-1. I played against Eddie Coleman that day and we had John Charles and Jack Charlton in our side. In the Man Utd side was the great Duncan Edwards and Bobby Charlton".  

Walt Wildman wrote to me with this point of debate

Bob,
I am a big football fan (stupidly called soccer in the US) and was discussing the offsides rule with a friend today.  I was hoping that perhaps FIFA would someday eliminate the rule, or at the least move offsides line from midfield to maybe the 35 yard line like the old NASL league in the USA.

Anyway, I was told that offsides is a relatively recent rule and that as recent as 1966 when England won the World Cup, there was no offisides. Can > you tell me when the rule was implemented and what it hoped to accomplish and perhaps what was the game like before offsides?  Thanks, Walt

Hi  What an interesting question !

Well actually the off-side rule is as old as the laws of the game itself. It has also been argued about just as long ! The original rule in the 1870s had the off-side line as 15 yards from the goaline. The Scottish FA disagreed with this as they believed it encouraged 'loafing' or 'sneaking'. For a while the two sides of the borders played with different rules until England changed to the Scottish rule of the using the goaline  in 1882.

I don't have a record of individual changes year by year but the next big change was in 1925 when the rule changed from 3 people between the goalline and the ball to just two - which sounds pretty much the same as the present rules. This apparantly completely altered the tactics of the game at the time, changing the centre-half's role as an attacking midfielder. It changed because the off-side trap was being used too well. Arsenal are the team credited for being the first to exploit  the new rules of the game best (nothing new there, then).

The only thing I can think off about 1966 not having the same rules is the goalkeeper not being allowed to pick up the ball from a back pass-kick from his own side. That was only introduced in the 1990s

I doubt that the off-side rule will ever go myself. It is THE most debated law and is one of the few laws to cause a major split in how it is played - yet it survives. I must admit when I used to play football in the play-ground we obviously didn't play the rule and you did use to get 'goal-hangers' someone who just hung around the goal waiting for the ball to come and scoring lots of goals ! I think it used to annoy the rest of us that the person playing with the least effort got - on paper at least - the most glory !

There has been a big reluctance to draw an extra line on the pitch which a 25 yard rule would require, you'll have to ask FIFA why that is -maybe it would just alter the look of a pitch which is pretty much unchanged since the 1800s.

Leeds United (my team) arguably lost a European Cup Final and a Championship in the 70-71 season itself thanks to 1970s interpretations of the off-side law, and the question of who was considered to be interferring with play. So the law did need to change.

But I honestly think the rule as it is today is the best its ever been. The interpretation of 'interferring with play' is at it's most liberal, and a person is no longer off-side if they are level with the defender - before they had to be behind the defender and that caused many many arguments, too.

It will continue to be tinkered with no doubt but lets face it the off-side law and the understanding of it is what separates the football fanatics from the football fair-weather followers - so long may it rule !

Andy Pugh asks

Bob, Can you help me with the answer to this little question - A record number of footballers were sent off in Football League and FA Cup matches on November 20 1982. How many ??? We have come up with lots of guesses in our office but do not know which one is right. Please help. Andy.

The answer is 15

Simon Wright wrote

Bob:   Love your site. Very different indeed and I can see it deserves further exploration. There's a lot to see.  I'm a West Brom supporter and contrary to your feature (cheeky sod!), we are well supported. Our average gate is a touch under 20,000.  Albion are one of the great clubs of this country.  
Self-recommendation is no recommendation of course but if you're into listing Albion websites, how about www.wbaunofficial.com  ?  It's updated daily with news plus observations every day from my other half. In addition, there's a very detailed Where are they Now featured 280 ex-Albion players. It's updated monthly and thanks to you will soon include the latest on Ian Collard and Ray Wilson.
You can be sure it's up to date and very accurate. Anyway, I really admire your site.   All the best   Simon

Simon's site is great, so that praise was very welcome, thanks. See December's Where are they now ?

Russell McGuinness enquired

I recently came across a picture of Denis, Bobby Charlton and George Best receiving silver trophies at a ceremony on the pitch at Old Trafford - someone I spoke to thinks it was in 1999 - do you have any further details ?

Thanks in advance, Russell McGuinness

I didn't know the answer to this, but Bob 70-71 Pages friend, Kåre Bjørklund, did.
There's a picture of the three inside a stadium in Best's new autobiography 'Blessed'. It's taken when they were given trophies "for services to the game" from the 2001 Football Awards. Could this be the same picture? Kåre
And indeed it was !

John Meager asked

What was the name of the football commentator (David something we think) who left World of Sport to become some purple religious nut?   Please help

That would be David Icke (Coventry City), but to be more accurate he became a turquoise religious nut ! See www.davidicke.com Actually, I wouldn't bother if I were you.

See more December 2001 news at the following ...

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